Mohave.net

Mohave.net
Discussing Mohave County Arizona Housing Market and other topics

New York Times Article

August 13th, 2008

A few days ago I read a NY Times article regarding Kingman.  I didn’t see the original article until I read comments on the article on a blog.  The comments were not complimentary.  Some of the less negative comments:

“The times is leading people to think that Kingman is a safe place to buy a house? I posted some info in the forum about Mohave County; they have about 20 properties a day going to foreclosure auction. When I drove through in June, the whole place looked like it was on sale. Read the article; 80k new houses?”

“Kingman is in the north west corner of AZ. Lots of CA and NV speculators ran up prices and the developers went nuts. There are so many bulldozed subdivision sites the country looks like an Inca desert drawing.”

I then read the article and researched the writer.  The writer is not a NY Times reporter but a free lance writer from Las Vegas.  I assumed the article was written as a pr piece to draw attention to the dwindling investment market in Mohave.  Being from LV, the writer probably has ties to someone with investments in the area.  The majority of the land purchases during the boom were by Las Vegans.

This is a feed of the original article (the NYT article requires registration, so this is from a NC paper).

http://www.starnewsonline.com/article/20080810/ZNYT02/808100
315&title=Developers_Poised_in_Arizona_to_Welcome_the_Sp
illover_of_Las_Vegas__x2019_s_Boom

Today the Miner has jumped on this with their own article. Now, based on a PR piece written by an LV writer (not a NY times reporter as the Miner calls him), we are going to gear up to the “inevitable” invasion.  From the article:

“Salem said while he believes growth is inevitable for Kingman, it is still important for that growth to be planned out accordingly.”People are going to come no matter what,” he said. “We need to be thinking into the future with many things: school, infrastructure, police, fire - all of the city services used to maintain a growth pattern like what we’re used to.”

Salem anticipated that once growth does get underway, especially following he completion of the four-lane Hoover Dam bridge in 2010, he expected it to be greater than the 5 to 6 percent rate it has been, but not so great as the boom experienced earlier this decade.”

 
http://www.kingmandailyminer.com/main.asp?SectionID=1&subsectionID=1&articleID=16958

I see dollar signs and lots of debt in the future for our little town.  The powers that be are counting on an illusion being trumpeted by speculators and developers who gambled and are losing their shirts, based on the current foreclosures.

No one has ever answered my questions regarding this “invasion” of Las Vegans.

..Why will the “bridge” cause hundreds of thousands of people to move here?
..Why will the “bridge” create more traffic through Kingman? Where is this additional traffic going to come from and why?
..Why would Las Vegans travel over 200 miles a day to live in Kingman when there are much closer alternatives in their own state if they choose to not live in Vegas proper?
..Prices have fallen so much in Vegas that larger houses are available for less money than in Kingman, why would they spend more to “commute” to a different state?
..When Las Vegans joke about the master planned community north of them and how they wouldn’t drive the 50 miles to live there, why would they drive 100 miles to live here? That community with a planned 150K homes cannot even get one home built. There is no demand.

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Bank Failure

July 26th, 2008

Feds close First National Bank of Arizona

Stung by problem loans and the real estate slump, Arizona’s largest locally-based bank was closed by regulators Friday.

Scottsdale-based First National Bank becomes the sixth bank failure of 2008 and the first involving an Arizona institution since 2002.

http://www.azcentral.com/12news/news/articles/2008/07/26/20080726biz-FNBA-ON-CP.html

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Housing Bailout Bill

July 24th, 2008

This is “good news” for the realtors and wall street who said the housing market would lock up if this wasn’t passed. FRM and FNM stocks were in free fall.  Happy days are here again for the irresponsible lenders and their stockholders. For the US dollar and the taxpayers, happy days, not so much.

The House of Representatives approved a bailout for Fanny Mae and Freddy Mac on Wednesday. The senate now has to vote, but apparently it’s all but a done deal.

http://www.bloomberg.com/apps/news?pid=20601103&sid=aEUQ4aE8D2HI&refer=news

******
There is a video on this page put up by Fed Up USA, regarding the bailout. (I can’t watch the video on Firefox but it works on IE)

http://www.fedupusa.org/

******
This has the tape from Senator Bunning blasting the fed about the bill that was passed by the house today. It’s located on the bottom of the page, just click on it to play.

http://financialpetition.org/

******
And Senator Bunning’s June speech from the Senate floor regarding the bill.

http://tinyurl.com/6hh2jd

******

Cramer also spoke about this bill. He said it was absolutely a necessity. He said it will stop home depreciation and keep the lenders investments worth more. In other words, help his wall street buddies who gambled and are losing.

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Kingman - Golden Valley Property “Bubble”

July 20th, 2008

This is my opinion of the GV/Kingman Bubble. I’m sure I missed some of the reasons the realtors think our bubble was justified, but at the bottom are the ones I hear most along with my opinion on each. The majority are things that are unchanged and are the same now as prior to the bubble.

Kingman was popular with retirees. They liked the low priced homes, the larger lots than Bullhead, the cooler weather than the river and the small town feeling. A lot of retirees moved here from the mid-west where prices were comparable and not out of their reach.

Now many who purchased prior to the bubble are having trouble paying their increasing property taxes based on all the speculation shooting their property “values” up by leaps and bounds. Especially with huge increases in utilities, gas and food and the decrease in any interest they may earn or the downward trend of any stocks they own.

Golden Valley was a place where people who couldn’t afford to live in Bullhead moved or people who wanted an acre or more of land to build on moved. Many worked in Laughlin and GV was a reasonable commute with much lower prices. They could buy property for a few thousand dollars and put an older trailer on it and live inexpensively. Or they could buy the same inexpensive acreage and build a nice house and not have to live in the city. They were willing to give up the benefits of living in Bullhead or Kingman for the acreage and/or the low costs. The pluses far out weighed the inconveniences and lack of infrastructure.

That is primarily what drove the increasing population of Golden Valley up to 2005, inexpensive living on acreage.

Then a builder decided that hundreds of thousands of people were chomping at the bit to move to Golden Valley and Kingman and live on 2000′-6000′ lots in cookie cutter houses with “rules” to keep the riff-raff out. He thought GV/Kingman would be a perfect bedroom community for LV. He borrowed millions and millions of dollars and started buying up thousands of acres in both Kingman and GV.

Then other speculators got wind of the plans and jumped in. They started saying that Golden Valley was the new Palm Springs (not sure what’s wrong with the old one, but whatever). They also borrowed millions of dollars from “no-rules” lenders or “willing to carry back paper” sellers and purchased the left over land and then moved on to every house available.

According to those “in the know”, hundreds of thousands of rich baby boomers from across the country were practically knocking down others to get their spot in Utopia (Golden Valley) or if not there, then Kingman. Kingman’s population was going to shoot up to as much as 1.5 million according to an article in the local paper and become the 3rd largest metropolitan area in the state.

Houses jumped 100% or more, mostly between 2004 & 2005. Land prices went up 2000% in GV in some cases and in all cases they went up many multiples of the early 2000’s prices.

Unfortunately the people buying the land and the houses were not, in most cases, the rich baby boomers. They were speculators and/or flippers. Most from out of state and many buying 5-10 houses each.

Why not, people were seeing houses sold and then resold weeks later for 100k profits. People were doubling, tripling and quadrupling their money by holding land only a couple of months or less. Lenders didn’t care whether you could pay them back or not. No credit, no money, no job, no problem was common in the lender ads at the time. All the old lending rules were thrown out the window as being “old fashioned”.

TV commercials and spokesman on national news shows were urging people to liberate the “free” equity in their homes. Take it out and use it for all the things you want and can’t afford. It’s your money, put it to use. Paying off your home was an extremely bad investment strategy, according to “experts” quoted in the media. You should never leave that “free” equity in your home.

Never once did I hear anyone say that this “free” money was not really “free”. It came with a high price. It was not your money, it was never your money. People were flocking to lenders to get their free money. It was a loan, just like putting the toys on a credit card. A loan that had to be paid back and unlike credit cards they could take your house if you didn’t pay them back.

People borrowed on their house to “pay off” credit cards, buy toys, take vacations, even pay for everyday living expenses. After all it was their money. Many said they were using their equity to “pay off” their debts. Huh?? For the math challenged, that is only exchanging one debt for another, more dangerous, kind of debt. Not “paying off” your debt. Oops, so much for “free” money.

A local realtor made a statement a few months ago that people should get all the equity out of their home that they could, so that they could “invest” in the deals that were showing up. Call me crazy, but borrowing money from your home to “invest” in the real estate market is less than smart.

Did anyone question this? Did anyone say what possible reason could these properties increase in value so quickly when nothing fundamental had changed at all? Did everyone’s salary go up a 100% or more? Did several big employers move here, paying 100k salaries to all? Did we suddenly move to a location closer to a big city? Did the national news media announce that Kingman/GV was the place everyone should move?

So now here we are. There was absolutely no fundamental reason for the price increases. Not here, and not in the rest of the country that experienced this “bubble”.

Now the prices have started falling and will no doubt continue to fall back to where they make sense for the salaries of the local population. Do the real estate professions or speculators accept this? No, they blame RAID(Residents Against Irresponsible Growth), a local reporter, the local newspaper, seniors, retirees, voters and anyone who dares question them.

They still think the increases were justified. They have lots of reasons…

1…A bypass over the Hoover Dam is just a couple of years away.

I think this is one of the weakest reasons of all. The bypass will allow truck traffic, which is now restricted. It does not shorten the miles to LV just makes the crossing of the actual river a little faster. LV will still be over a 100 miles away. And you will have the increased traffic because of the 18 wheelers.

2…Las Vegas and California are too expensive.

Obviously they haven’t paid attention to the falling home prices and land prices in both Cali and LV, we’re aready more expensive than many areas of Cali on a per square foot basis. And no matter what anyone says, our prices should not be compared to large metropolitan areas.

3…LV workers will live here because they can get more for their money.

Ok, even if this was true and I don’t think it is anymore, I fail to see the logic in this. Why would someone drive three hours or more each day to and from a job? Even ignoring the huge gas expense, that’s 3 hours a day out of your life on the road.

Why would someone work in Nevada (income tax free) and live in Arizona (income tax to pay)? Why would someone work in LV and then on the weekends, when they have time to shop and play, choose to do it in Kingman/GV instead of the entertainment capital of Nevada?

4…Hundreds of thousands of baby boomers are coming.

This is almost laughable, thousands of other small towns across the country are also saying this. Most retirees I know either stayed in their town when they retired or moved to a state where their children lived. Those who retired to Florida and/or Arizona usually did it because of the low cost of living. Without that, many retirees are moving out of those states and/or not moving in. Unless baby boomers are a new breed, I doubt they are all going to set out and move to a new state when they retire. And if they do, it will still not increase the houses needed. Most will sell in one place and buy in another. The increased inventory when they start selling will not make prices go up.


5…Businesses will relocate here from California because of the low prices and low taxes.

This is a myth perpetuated by retelling. If realtors and speculators would check the actual numbers they would find the truth. California commercial prices do not bubble like residential does. Commercial prices here bubbled even more than residential. Land and commercial rentals here are higher than many areas in California.

We have imposed huge impact and building permit fees as if we were a big city. Commercial property taxes here are ridiculously high compared to California and there is no protection against them doubling or more year after year as there is in California. I don’t know what workers comp rates are in Arizona but I would guess they are lower than Cali. That is a cost that is out of control in Cali and could likely be the main thing cheaper here. Businesses move for profit. If the cost of doing business continues to climb in Arizona, businesses will bypass us for greener pastures. Phoenix is already losing businesses because of escalating taxes.

6…Kingman has both the 40 and 93 freeways and will attract companies based on this prime location.

Once again, did Kingman move? As far as I know we’ve had the 40 running through Kingman for as long as the 40 has existed. We were always a prime location for businesses who need the 40 for transport to and from Cali. In fact, we were probably a much more prime location in the past before the land prices escalated. Higher land prices will decrease the interested businesses not increase them. Businesses cannot afford to have their property values and corresponding taxes increase every year. That is not a plus.

7…We have perfect weather.

Although I like the weather here, a lot of people feel it is too hot in the summer and too cold in the winter. And more importantly, the weather hasn’t changed. We had the same weather when our home and land prices were cheaper. Prices don’t go to the moon over night because of weather.

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Bank Failures - IndyMac Seized

July 12th, 2008

I said months ago that there would be be bank failures from this fiasco. If anyone has any money, they need to be sure it is in an insured account and this includes retirement accounts. This is the biggest so far, but others are on the same banana peel. Wachovia and Wamu are two other large banks that are in danger.

http://tinyurl.com/5s57cp

Latest victim of mortgage crisis, IndyMac taken over

By Jonathan Burton & John Letzing, MarketWatch
Last update: 8:31 p.m. EDT July 11, 2008
Comments: 438

SAN FRANCISCO (MarketWatch)– IndyMac Bancorp Inc. became the biggest casualty of the subprime mortgage crisis on Friday, as federal regulators shut down the troubled Pasadena, Calif.-based savings bank in one of the largest U.S. bank failures ever.

The Federal Deposit Insurance Corp. said in a statement it will take over operations of IndyMac
, which will open for business on Monday as IndyMac Federal Bank. The thrift had total assets of $32.01 billion as of March 31.

http://tinyurl.com/5omaba

Regulators seize IndyMac Bank
Updated 55m ago | Comments113 | Recommend16

LOS ANGELES (AP)— IndyMac Bank’s assets were seized by federal regulators on Friday after the mortgage lender succumbed to the pressures of tighter credit, tumbling home prices and rising foreclosures.

The bank is the largest regulated thrift to fail and the second largest financial institution to close in U.S. history, regulators said.
***********
….And the importance of being sure you are covered……………………

“Some 10,000 depositors had funds in excess of the insured limit, for a total of $1 billion in potentially uninsured funds, the FDIC said.”

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Harvard University Annual Housing Report

June 24th, 2008

Shaky job market threatens housing recovery
Housing slump rivals deepest slowdowns in 60-plus years: Report

By Amy Hoak, MarketWatch
Last update: 12:01 a.m. EDT June 23, 2008
Comments: 177
CHICAGO (MarketWatch) — The housing slump, already shaping up to be the worst in a generation, still hasn’t run its full course, according to Harvard University’s annual report on housing, released on Monday.

Housing Slump

The State of the Nation’s Housing 2008
Joint Center for Housing Studies

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Las Vegas Links

June 22nd, 2008

Here are a few LV links on the housing market, unemployment and Coyote Springs.

Coyote Springs is a development 60 miles north of LV that was considered a “sure thing” for LV employees looking for less expensive housing. I pointed out last year that this subdivision was 40 miles closer to LV than Golden Valley, in the same state for simpler tax purposes and on a road (I15) with faster speed limits. I thought this had a much better chance of being a “bedroom community” for LV than Golden Valley. I was mocked by all the local speculators and realtors for not being very smart. Coyote Springs was supposed to have 150,000 houses and be a “planned development”. Now they don’t intend to even start building until late 2009. I thought even 60 miles to commute was out of line, let alone 105. Seems that gas prices are making this irrational commute even less appealing. Even in California, very few people commute those distances every day. The idea that LV workers are going to commute to Golden Valley every day is just ridiculous, regardless of what the speculators and realtors say.

Expensive commuting not holding the charm
Gas price spike could bode ill for an outlying place like Coyote Springs
http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2008/jun/19/expensive-commuting-not-holding-charm/

Local existing-home sales surge
Resales pass 2,600 units for first month since March ‘07; new-home sales stall
http://www.lvrj.com/business/20557609.html?numComments=44

ECONOMY: State’s jobless rate at 14-year high
Construction, casinos see Southern Nevada job bases dwindle
http://www.lvrj.com/business/20625594.html

Nevada’s unemployment rate surges to 6.2 percent
http://www.lvrj.com/breaking_news/20603459.html

The Las Vegas Economy: How Is Sin City Coping?
http://www.gambling911.com/Las-Vegas-Economy-062008.html

A few older links:

No neighbors, no neighborhood
http://www.lasvegassun.com/news/2008/may/21/no-neighbors-no-neighborhood/

DEVELOPMENT: LV land prices rise in quarter
Excluding sales around Strip area, average price was $939,400 in 2007’s final three months
http://www.lvrj.com/business/15760492.html

REAL ESTATE: Down, down, down
56 of 61 Las Vegas Valley ZIP codes show falling home values
http://www.lvrj.com/business/15918837.html

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Buyer Beware Land Sales & More

May 9th, 2008

Base on sales records I’ve been watching the last several months, the Golden Valley area has the potential to become a poster child for land sales fraud. Similar to the infamous “swamp” land sales of Florida in the 1920’s.  I’ve been reading complaints from buyers on internet forums and comments from realtors that say Arizona is a “buyer beware” state.

I recently saw two lots advertised for sale in a Golden Valley “subdivision” I hadn’t heard of before.  Looking them up, I saw that they are in an area where apparently someone split acreage into 1 acre plots and was selling them for 16k and up per acre.  I haven’t driven to see them yet, but I believe there are no roads even cut in and of course like most land in Golden Valley, no utilities or water available.

These two caught my eye because they were listed at 10k each, less than the others.  As most land in GV bought recently, they had an out of state owner. Looking up the records, to thicken the plot, they had been purchased in March 2008, for 16k and were now back on the market less than two months later for 10k.  I’m not sure if the original sale used a realtor or not, but apparently the purchaser did not do any investigating.  He will probably lose the entire 32k he spent on the lots, unless he finds an equally trusting buyer who jumps on the chance to purchase these lots for 10k each.  Then he’ll only loose 12k plus the cost of buying and selling them.  According to the county maps these lots do not just have a wash running through a portion of the property as many do, but both lots actually ARE a wash. I see no way they could be used for anything based on the tax map.  I see no comments on the listing regarding this piece of information.

I am astounded at the number of buyers who are purchasing land with no utilities or water available and many times no roads even cut in, for prices that they could purchase land with utilities etc. in most any other state, including California.  Many times the properties have washes that make them unbuildable, even if someone actually wanted to build in an area with no roads or utilities. 

The prices have gotten so out of line that there is little chance of attracting an end user that would like to purchase a lot and build a home or place a manufactured home on the lot.  Especially knowing they would have to live “off the grid”.  An option that used to be popular because of the low cost of land. Purchasers now are apparently counting on irrational appreciation and sales to “developers”.  And those speculators that don’t even investigate the property before purchasing, are being taken for a ride in huge numbers.

I also recently saw a home in GV for sale that I looked up because of the price which was considerably less than others that were as new.  It appears that the home was built in the wash that was flooded a year or so ago and was reported on in the paper.  Renters scurried from the houses and apparently lost all their belongings.  They did not realize that their homes were built in a wash. 

I wondered at the time how someone could build homes in a wash and assumed it was a builder not familiar with the area.  Looking up property owners in the area, I found that not to be the case and that the builder was a local builder.  All the homes that were sold in this “wash” were sold to out of state buyers who bought more than one apiece (one sold for 219k and others for about 189k)  and then rented them to families.  These same buyers also bought multiple homes in other areas built by the same builder.  Many are now in foreclosure and values have dropped over 100k in all cases.  The land not built on is still owned by the local builder who also built the home currently for sale.

Looking at the posting for the home for sale, I see nothing mentioned about the wash or the prior flood.  They do say the home needs tlc and the pictures show it is missing the appliances.  Because of the price, I expect someone will purchase it as a rental and put another family at risk.  If they purchase it without checking out the area, they might not even know the problems.  And apparently, the realtors are not going to put this risk out there in bold print.  I can’t imagine anyone selling real estate here does not remember the story.

Another home that just came on the market, is located in Kingman in a subdivision where every home has been in foreclosure or is still owned by the builder or his employee.  There are few owner occupied, most are vacant or rentals.  The listing says “fanastic price”, except that it is not.  There is, currently on the market, another model with an additional 350 square feet for $2600. less. Also 7 other homes for $12,500. more, that have the same additional 350 square feet.  And several more just now entering foreclosure.  And all of the current sales are at discounts of 100-130k off of the original sales prices.  I wonder how many realtors don’t mention any of this to propective buyers.

Because of the secrecy of the mls system and the lack of past records of sales available online from the tax collecter in this county, buyers are going to have a difficult time discovering any of these things.  If realtors don’t give this information to the buyers, I can see law suits out the ying yang appearing as things get worse.   

In other states, these type of law suits are being dismissed because the information on properties and sales were readily available to the buyer on the internet.  That is not the case here, and I think that might come back to haunt some of the locals who are less than forthcoming about the properties they are selling.  “Due dilligence” for buyers is very difficult, if not impossible.  Particularly for out of state or recent residents who might not even know where to look for the information.

Recent sales information on the tax collector site used to be a clickable link which showed the past sales for the property in a list with dates and sales prices.  The link disappeared right about the time homes started selling for double and triple the last sale and land was showing multiples of 20 times and more what the last sale was.  I imagine it was hard for realtors to explain why the seller was getting hundreds of thousands of dollars for owning property for as little as a couple of weeks.  I saw one land parcel go from a sale of 100k to 5.5 million in less than a year and it was back on the market for over 11 million at the time.  And then magically the links disappeared from all the tax records.  I don’t know the reasoning for removing the prior sales from the online tax records, but it seems very deceptive to me and not normal for most states to hide that information from possible buyers.

Foreclosures on land are becoming more noticeable and much larger in dollar amount.  I recently saw one in Bullhead for over 16 million dollars.  Unpaid property taxes are also very noticeable, especially on this last payment due.  And include at least one prominent land owner who has the majority of his hundreds of properties showing delinquent taxes and at least one parcel just had a trustee sale posted.  Since some land owners use multiple names to purchase property, these notices are somewhat disquised by being under the less familiar names. 

There is the potential for billions of dollars in losses for banks/lenders that loaned in this area, based on sales prices that were way out of line for desert land with no utilities, water or roads that were purchased by speculators, both big and small, with visions of dollar signs in their heads and lacking the financial means to back up their purchases. 

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Another Rant on the Mohave County MLS Board

May 3rd, 2008

This is a continuation of my previous two posts on the Mohave MLS. 
 
This is the direct quote from the site I was using regarding their removal of addresses, locations, and directions per the Havasu/Kingman MLS:

 

“This policy will be enforced for all internet-based displays of listings in this market (addresses of properties for sale are not allowed on the internet in Lake Havasu).”
 
This is the reply when I questioned why pictures were also not displayed. Apparently if pictures were allowed, those pesky buyers could just drive around all through the city and find the house for sale.
 
“But this change affects all web site that show listed properties in our county. Unless a buyers goes to the MLS website they won’t be able to view any pictures or addresses. “
 
Actually this is wrong though. Even the public MLS site does not have addresses. They have pictures, but no addresses.  The “public” ie “buyers” are not to be trusted with this info apparently.
 
 
************
Now for the past two weeks I have been emailing back and forth to a realtor in Kingman that came unglued because I made comments about the mls “board”. He felt I was out of line. I’ve decided to put up some of my replies to his emails. I’ve only put my replies, you’ll have to guess at his statements.  And if you doze off during this very long post, I’ll understand.  But I did cut out at least half of my answers and all of his.……………
 
 
I think they’ve made it pretty clear that no one is allowed to post addresses on the internet in this county.  Which makes Mohave stand out against 99% of the rest of the country, including California, Nevada and the rest of Arizona.  All of which not only have addresses on realtor.com, but on various other web sites.  I guess they want to sell houses, strange concept.
 
That is what makes me furious and tells me that your head honchos feel their mls info is so secret that no one should be able to use it to buy or sell a house.  And they will fight having any info on the internet regardless of how difficult that makes it for buyers in the area.  If that isn’t egotistical, I don’t know what to call it.  I could call it tyranny I guess, does that suit you better?
 
Your board has made it impossible to even find out what area a house is in, let alone the address.  And apparently they could care less , they have no concern about what buyers or sellers want, only what they think is best for them. 
 
************
I was just as furious when they took the addresses out of realtor.com in 2006.  Before they did that I could look each day and if I saw something interesting, I could email the specific realtor and ask questions.  It didn’t require me to bother anyone every day with questions.  Just like I still can in 99% of the country (the part you really don’t seem to get). I told you that when they took the addresses out, I stopped even looking.  Because if you think I’m going to email every realtor on every listing to find out where it is, you’re sadly mistaken.  Especially, as I told you at that time, I have had very few realtors in Kingman that even return emails.  Kingman seems to be in a twilight zone where realtors want to go back to the days where they get mls sheets each week and they have to manually go through looking at them with no computer access.  I hate to break it to them but most buyers these days use the internet and to banish that use seems very stupid and self serving.  And the droves of baby boomers you say are coming might not like being told they are not allowed to use the internet to shop.  Kingman may be archaic when it comes to computers and the internet, but most people in other states are not.  They will expect the same service they get in their present location and they will never get that here.
 
When my realtor, who I’d turned to because of Mohave pulling off of realtor.com,  came up with the HBSR site and  signed me up, it was wonderful.  Not only did I get all the new listings in my criteria every day, but I could look up streets to see what else might be listed on that street and also look up by mls number if I was curious about another property not in my criteria.  I could save the properties and be notified if anything changed.  I had quite a few properties saved when they had to wipe out the addresses and locations.  The fact that this was a non-public site and you cannot access it unless you are working with a realtor and they also need to re-subscribe you periodically, I see absolutely no reason that it should have been treated as if it was another realtor.com.  So, you may not agree with me, but I feel it was done just to show that they don’t care about anyone but themselves.
 
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You keep trying to convince me and everyone else that Kingman is so unsafe that the rules were made because the safety of the sellers was a concern.  I said that’s bull and I still think so.  I asked questions and you just keep coming back with it’s unsafe in Kingman to put the addresses and that’s why the decision was made.  Do you think that will make buyers want to move here, knowing that this is one of very few areas in the country that is so unsafe that addresses are not allowed on the net?
 
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I have never felt more dislike for any group of people than your “board”.  I think they are doing their best to discourage anyone from buying here and I pity your poor sellers.  I wonder if they realize how hard your group is trying to prevent anyone from knowing their home is for sale.  Like I said I would encourage anyone trying to sell in this town to NOT use the mls.  I don’t see the benefit.  Most realtors don’t advertise in the paper or in the “home” book and they’re not allowed to use the internet.  And who knows what they will outlaw next.  There are far more avenues on the internet available to a seller that are much further reaching than your secret society that no one is allowed to breach.  When I sold, in another state, I wanted the info out there everywhere possible.  Our house was even on the home show on TV, accessible to millions of people in our area and the address was prominently displayed, just like everyone else’s.  Even the homes with multi million dollar price tags, as I pointed out to you, have addresses listed.
 
I have never said you single handedly made the rules.  But you elected these people and you all seem to be okay with their decisions.  So I guess indirectly you are responsible for the rules.  I can’t believe that you are against them and absolutely no one else is.  I think a truer fact is that most of the realtors probably don’t even realize the addresses are not allowed on the internet nor the consequences in banning internet shopping.
 
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Why do you feel that people should pay you to give you advertising and tools to help you sell property?  I guess I just don’t get your thinking.  You do realize that the business that is getting the benefit of the advertising usually pays the advertiser, don’t you?  Isn’t the commission you receive enough?  Now you want the websites willing to advertise your property and/or the buyers to pay you to even be able to view the properties you have for sale?
 
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This is where I have a problem with your thinking with the mls.  Why is getting this information into as many venues as possible, “a big problem”?  You have yet to explain to me why it is even an issue.  If it was me, I would be thrilled about all the FREE advertising of something that only I have and only I can sell.  What part of this don’t you get?  These are contracts, no one can purchase one of the listings without the listing agent getting her “cut”.  So why is it a horrible thing to advertise these homes on the internet, to a world wide audience? Why do you insist that this is a way of cheating the realtors?  First your reasoning was that Kingman is unsafe for sellers(when none of the rest of the country is) and now the reason is that it is stealing to use the mls info to sell property.  NO ONE can use the mls feed to sell a property, except a member of the mls.  And with hbsr, no one could even access the site without a realtor member of the mls.
 
Once again, tell me what this non-advertising gains……..
 
 
So now we no longer have hbsr.  We can no longer look at anything except fsbo’s or reo’s that are not listed by a broker.  There is no reasonable way to work with the mls without being a “member” of your mls.  I have the money and ability to purchase a home, but I will not continue to fight an entire real estate board just to be able to find out what is available.
 
 
So tell me how this benefits your group.  What did you gain by my not being able to see addresses on realtor.com and contact the listing broker?  What have you gained by taking away a realtor’s sales tool like hbsr, so that I can no longer look at and/or track properties with all the info included
 
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I may be the only person in the world who has a problem with this, as you have indicated.  You say no one but me has ever complained.  But I suspect there are others who you will never hear from.  If, when I was looking for a place to relocate, I had not been able to look for properties with prices and addresses on line, I would have just moved on to another location.  You would never have heard from me.  I would assume that any place that does not allow shopping and comparing, has something to hide. I’m sure I’m not the only buyer in the country that wants this info before committing to a move.  Kingman is very backward when it comes to technology, but other places are not.  And buyers who might come from other areas might have expectations similiar to mine.  Especially Californians.
 
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So I’m not longer furious or “unhinged” as you called me, just resigned to the fact that we will probably not buy anything here that is listed in the mls.  You guys win, but I’m not sure why you think it’s a win and exactly how my getting this information was “stealing” from your mls as you said.  I am extremely offended that this is what it all boils down to, my wanting information that I can get from any other mls in the country is somehow considered “theft” in Mohave and a “big problem” for realtors.
 

 

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More Mohave County Realtors

April 19th, 2008

Now it’s official, NO addresses of properties for sale in the Bullhead, Lake Havasu, Kingman, Golden Valley MLS area are allowed to be posted anywhere on the internet. And they intend to enforce it. Good job guys, take a bad market and send the interested potential buyers away.  This is the most ridiculous decision I have ever heard.

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